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| Nipping fret tang? http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=11315 |
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| Author: | James Orr [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:57 am ] |
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Hi everyone Does anyone have a method for getting the tang off of fret ends to go over binding? I have the LMI fret cutters and they're not even scratching it. I tried putting a cutting wheel in my dremel, but it's been difficult to control so far. |
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| Author: | Rod True [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 5:05 am ] |
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James, for the past couple of guitars, I've used my small belt sander and just sanded the tang off. 
I use the vertical sander, not the disk. It gets hot of course, but just have a small plastic container of water near by to cool it off. Practice first to get the hang of it. This works well. Having said that, I've now bought the stew-mac fret tang nippers. But seeing as for now your just building this one guitar (I bet you'll get back into it  ) this method will work well for you.
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| Author: | Howard Klepper [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 5:22 am ] |
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The fret tang nipper that Stew Mac sells is the best thing to happen to fretting in the 37 years I've been doing it. |
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| Author: | Evan Gluck [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 5:58 am ] |
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I made my own from a Klein cutter but I also bought the Frank Ford one from LMI at the GAL convention and I must say it is the coolest thing ever. Then of course there is fire and the wheel.
Evan |
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| Author: | crazymanmichael [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 6:01 am ] |
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many folks file the tang. lmi is now selling a gadget for filing, especially when doing ss frets which are so hard the sm tool is not terribly effective. others have used cutting and grinding wheels/stones in their dremel. ordinary fret cutting nippers are not really suitable. if you are using ordinary fret wire the sm tool is probably the most convenient first choice, or buy the original kline knibbler for less than half the sm price and do the simple modification which is all sm does to charge the extra bucks. |
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| Author: | JJ Donohue [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 6:36 am ] |
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What Howard said...and he has 32 years on me! Seriously...it is very quick and accurate. |
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| Author: | James Orr [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:39 am ] |
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Awesome guys -- thanks! I'll fidget with the dremel and grinder a bit more, then try the file. I'm glad to hear the Stew Mac nipper works so well. Definitely something to grab for the future at some point 
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| Author: | Telfer [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:55 am ] |
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I wonder if its possible to heat the fret with the dremel grinding to the point where it starts to turn blue? You know how ordinary steel drill bits will turn blue if overheated. |
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| Author: | JohnAbercrombie [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:05 am ] |
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[QUOTE=Telfer] I wonder if its possible to heat the fret with the dremel grinding to the point where it starts to turn blue? You know how ordinary steel drill bits will turn blue if overheated.[/QUOTE] Most fret wire is brass alloy, so it won't turn blue. It will get red hot, though, since brasses tend to clog up grinding materials. I noticed this when using a Dremel abrasive cutoff disk to trim the fret ends close to the fingerboard. That's also why filing works a lot better than grinding to take off the tang if you are using a bound fingerboard. A few minutes in the shop and you can improvise a jig to hold the fret (upside-down) so you can file off the tang. It only takes a few seconds with a good file.- and the result is flush. I found that even using tang nippers, I had to finish with a file to get the underside of the fret flush. Cheers John |
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| Author: | Telfer [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:43 am ] |
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[QUOTE=JohnAbercrombie] That's also why filing works a lot better than grinding to take off the tang if you are using a bound fingerboard. A few minutes in the shop and you can improvise a jig to hold the fret (upside-down) so you can file off the tang. It only takes a few seconds with a good file.- and the result is flush. I found that even using tang nippers, I had to finish with a file to get the underside of the fret flush. [/QUOTE] Good answer John, thanks! Do you have a pic of your home made tang fileing jig? |
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| Author: | James Orr [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 9:51 am ] |
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Thanks for these pics, John. What kind of file do you use? This setup looks really slick and inexpensive. I could easily improvise it by using a wood block to hold the fret down so I could cut the tang slot. I don't have anything to cut metal. I gave grinding another go and ruined five frets. One wrong angle and they're gone. I'm going to give John's method a go. 
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| Author: | Telfer [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:09 am ] |
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Just tried an experiment: I took a peice of Bubinga 3/4" x 3/4" x 12" and used a coping saw to put a tang slot in one side, a quarter inch from the end. Put the fret wire in the slot and pounded it in with a rubber hammer - nice and tight, you dont want it to vibrate when your're fileing it. Turned it upside down on top of a cedar block and filed off the tang very quickly - perfect! Held it down with nothing more than hand pressure. It was stainless steel too! |
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| Author: | Kahle [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:10 am ] |
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The tang nippers are expensive (for what they are) but they are worth the price. |
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| Author: | JohnAbercrombie [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 1:17 pm ] |
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James- Thanks for posting the pics! Nothing special about the file I use- I just grab one out of the drawer- I think it's a Mill Bastard flat file. You don't want anything too fine or it will clog up more easily. Too coarse and you will soon know it as you will be vibrating and bending the fret more than cutting. John |
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| Author: | James Orr [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 2:06 pm ] |
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Well, I have all my frets hammered in over John Watkins' faux binding. The fret ends all stick out a bit though -- any tips there? My current idea is to drop some CA in and press the ends down with a clamp. Though I'm worried about dripping CA out on the ebony. I went to the hardware store and asked for a file that would file the fret. Files are new to me, so I wasn't sure if there were special kinds. What I found was that a setup just like yours, John, along with the dremel, was perfect, followed by some touch up with the file. |
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| Author: | JohnAbercrombie [ Sun Mar 18, 2007 3:14 pm ] |
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James- Hesh had a good explanation of fretting (Search on hesh and fretting and you should find it), and he mentioned the light tap that is used to bend the fret end down- he called it a 'tonk'- and that kinda gives the right idea of a firm tap that's enough to bend the fret end down but not enough to damage it or pop the fret loose. Then file or sand the fret ends flush, round ends and you are about done. BTW, I think it was Tony Karol that mentioned using the small felt buffer and some polishing compound (rouge) with the Dremel to polish the frets as the last step- works really well. Cheers John |
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| Author: | Dave Stewart [ Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:10 am ] |
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If cost is an issue, Radioshack sells a "nibbler" for about 1/4 of the cost of Stew-macs nipper. Same idea & works great. File a small groove just in front of the shear so the fret edge "tracks" and you're away! I've used it for 3 guitars so far. |
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| Author: | crowduck [ Mon Mar 19, 2007 7:37 am ] |
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RShack Nibbler $3.97 StewMac Nibbler $42.53 It's worth noting that SM sells 2 sizes for medium/small, and large/jumbo, sooooooo do the math, and get 2 from RS for less than $10. CrowDuck |
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| Author: | CarltonM [ Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:33 am ] |
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Very interesting, Dave and Chris. Does it give you a clean, flush cut, or do you have to do some touch-up? |
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| Author: | SimonF [ Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:48 am ] |
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I have the StewMac fret tang remover and it does an excellent job. However, if you use stainless steel frets (which I now use exclusively) - then this tool is not the one you want. Frank Ford developed an ingeniouus tool that takes care of the tang for stainless steel wire. It is expensive but works very fast and does a flawless job. I still have the StewMac nipper. It is in perfect condition and was used for only about 5 guitars. It still has loads of life still in the cutting edge. Send me an email at info@fayguitars.com if you are interested in buying it for a reasonable price. Peace Out, Simon |
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| Author: | crowduck [ Mon Mar 19, 2007 9:22 am ] |
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I can't say how well either the StewMac or Radio Shack work, but here's one from eBay @ $22.00 that looks like a 'dead ringer' to the RS $3.97 tool. Wonder if the eBay seller gets his from RS, modifies, then resells on eBay. For less than $5 I'll try modding a RS. If it doesn't work out I'll probably find some other use for the $3.97 tool, no great loss. eBay Nibbler $21.99 CrowDuck |
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| Author: | Dave Stewart [ Mon Mar 19, 2007 12:07 pm ] |
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I use the Radioshack one, although here it's more like C$12. It works well, although I usually straighten any distortion of the tang and lightly file off the burr - no biggy. I've found it best to make a double tang cut and THEN cut the frets apart. (If you cut then to length, then try to nibble each end, you'll get more distortion.) |
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| Author: | crazymanmichael [ Mon Mar 19, 2007 12:47 pm ] |
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whilst i use the sm tool, the basic klein nibbler which i mentioned in my early post in thiw thread above is also on ebay, e.g., item 290093379009. this is a fairly heavy duty professional tool, and you will have to cut a notch as sm has to do on theirs, but it is the same basic tool as sm's, at about 1/2 the price. they cut clean with no distortion. p.s. after one of my moves a few years ago i misplaced my klein and had to get a new on quick, hence the sm. |
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